I am 37 years old and have never owned a "big" rifle.  A .22 is as big as I have.  I have been hunting for 23 years and consider myself a pretty avid hunter, but when it comes to rifles I know very little about them.  I live in a Shotgun only area for deer hunting, so the need for a rifle was non-existent.  I guess I never felt the need to own something I couldn't use.  Well, now with the spread of CWD, the rifle areas have grown and now include areas that I bowhunt and that are within 15 minutes of my home.  I actually took my first deer with a rifle this past fall with a rifle borrowed from a friend (a .300 Ultra Mag).  This same friend has got me started coyote hunting this year as well.  I am currently using his .243, and he uses his .22-250.  There are just so many calibers out there and it has been pretty overwhelming to me to try to decide what is best.  I have had several people suggest things to me, but with all of them pulling or pushing in different directions, I feel the need to go outside my friends to get advice from strangers with more knowledge about rifles (not that my friends have no knowledge, but we are all from Shotgun territory).  
 
I would really like to keep the cost down because I really can't afford to spend a couple thousand on rifles.  Also, I would only probably shoot a couple times a year at the most. I don't feel the need to have a very expensive rifle sitting around that I shoot one or two times a year.  I would like a rifle that is big enough for deer, elk and caribou.  Many people have told me that a rifle like that is too big for hunting coyotes.  So, i guess I am wondering if I need two rifles, one for big game and one for varmints.
 
I have had people recommend guns such as the Remington 770, the Mossberg ATR, the Stevens 200, and the Savage.  I have read good and bad about each and it really gets hard to know what to believe.  One thing I have been told by pretty much everyone is that if I would go with a package gun like that, I would definately need to put on a new scope because the ones they come with are not real high quality.  
 
That particular price range looks manageable though with those guns.  Not saying I have to get one of them just want your opinions and knowledge to be shared with me.
 
1) Low cost, High Quality rifle?
2)Do I need two seperate rifles to suit my needs or is there one gun to do both??
3)What would you recommend/Why?

Welcome to THL Bschliem. (Is that a random selection of letters?)
 
Yours is a perennial question, and you're not likely to get any answers here or any other place, that will give you the definitive answer... because there isn't one.
 
The relevant facts as I see them are:
 
You have a better selction of good rifles to choose from today than has ever been offered. That means that it would be very difficult to make a "bad" decision, so don't worry about that. High quality rifles can be had for considerably less than $1000 dollars. Find one that appeals TO YOU and get it.
 
If you are in a "shotgun area", you seriously don't need an "Utra magnum", a "magnum", a "short magnum" or even a "super short magnum". Since you are "new" to calibers above .22, and especially since you are "used to" the effect that "big around" (and it doesn't get much bigger around than a shotgun slug), I would urge you to consider a "larger" rather than "smaller" caliber. I wouldn't recommend anything less than .30 caliber, and would recommend well above that.
 
At the .30 caliber end, I would argue strongly for the .308 Winchester. It's a tried and true cartridge and more than capable for anything in "shotgun country". In fact, it's just fine for deer to 400 yds (although that's a bit long for my tastes with ANY caliber), and can hold it's own to 300 for the likes of elk and moose.
 
However, up from .30 is going to put game - expecially deer - on the ground faster. Of course there's no faster than falling-right-down, but falling-right-down will happen more often with a bullet that's bigger around. So... the 8x57 would be an excellent choice, but I'd be willing to bet dollars-to-donuts that you would place that cartridge near last on your choices, so next of the common choices would be the .338 Federal. It's a .338 caliber bullet on the .308 Win case. It's new, but it's a good cartridge.
 
In that same vein, going up in caliber, is another excellent cartridge, the .358 Winchester, which is the .308 Winchester necked up to .35 caliber. This one is approaching the obsolete category, and if you're not a handloader, will be difficult to get ammo for. Which brings up the .35 Whelen which is experiencing a bit of a resurgence these days, and it's easy to find rifles chambered in this cartridge and ammo is readily available. It is the .30-06 necked up to .35 caliber. In my opinion, probably the best choice given the starting point you gave.
 
Next would be either of the new .375 cartridges - the .375 Ruger, and the .376 Steyr. Both are excellent cartridges, but ammo is expensive for both, and the Ruger is likely to win the commercial sales battle.
 
Finally up are the "big bores". If you go to the 'modern cartridges', price of rifles and ammo goes up, fast, with bullet diameter. All of the "modrn ones" are unnecessarily large for your requirements. HOWEVER... if you go with cartridges that are traditionally "black powder" cartridges, you can have a lot of fun. Probably the the number one "new" "old" cartridge is the .45-70 Government. Lots of lever guns chambered in that today, and ammo is inexpensive (it can also be stupidly expensive) and easy to come by. The beginning of the Cowbay Action Shooting (CAS) game has made lots of "big bore" cartridge guns and ammo available. This could be good selection, but probably as likely to get chosen as the 8x57.
 
With regard to:
Quote:
2)Do I need two seperate rifles to suit my needs or is there one gun to do both??
Contrary to what many will erroneously tell you, one size DOES NOT fit all. Get the tool for your specific need.
 
Also a word to the wise. Beware of recommendations for "premium" anything - be it cartridge (RUM), bullets (as in "premium bullets"), or optics. All the "old" cartridges are just fine, and "ultra magnums" (or any other "magnum for that matter), aren't necessary... all the currently available bullets are excellent game bullets... and you can easily spend WAY too much on 'scopes. Caveat emptor.
 
There... there's your first "unbiased" (hardly, I am seriously biased) opinion from someone that's "not your friend".
 
Rememeber, keep it fun. There are precious few "wrong" decisions to make with respect to choosing a rifle maker. If you find yourself 'stressed', you're thinking too hard.
 
Bon chance,
Paul
 
PS - You would be greatly served by going back through the old THL postings. There is a lot of good info in exactly the area you are seeking.
 
Paul

Welcome bschliem!

As gitano stated there are plenty of threads with your question, but hey, you are new here so why not give you some of the info you came here to seek.

Some questions come to mind.
1. How far are your average shots going to be?
    a. 0-100 yds
    b. 0-250 yds
    c. 0-350 yds
    d. beyond 400 yards.

2. What are you planning to hunt? ie deer, elk, water buffalo, elephant?

Now to answer a couple of questions you had. Remington IMO makes about as good as you can get without going and getting a load. That's not saying that Savage is not as good, I'm just talking about what I know. My arsenal contains only 5 nonremingtons and only 3 of those are U.S. made, a winchester shotgun. a Winchester 22WRF and a Marlin bolt 22, the others being unadulterated military Mauser and a Mosnin-Nagant. All the rest are Remingtons.

OK, now that we have what brand to buy taken care of lets talk about caliber/cartridge. Paul mentioned the 35 Whelen and I think that is one of the greatest cartridges ever assembled. My 700BDL has accounted for many, many elk and a few deer along the way. It's even acompanied me while shooting prairie dogs. You know how hard they can be to kill!! It's a very accurate round with plenty of bullet weights to choose from. I use mainly 250 grain Hornadys in mine but 200 graners run well also. It will take any game on this continent with ease. From Alabama whitetails to Alaskan moose, the 35 Whelen has it covered. I might even take on a big coastal brown bear. Might if I was NUTS!!! No, I'll leave those coastal browns to the guys who have a bigger pair than I do. But, I feel the 35 Whelen plenty big anough to tackle that job too, given proper bullet selection.

So, why is it, you ask, do I have so many different rifles? Well, because I can.

RJ

p.s. gitano makes typos???

Here's a good thread
http://www.thehunterslife.com/forums/showthread.php?t=11442
 
My money would be on a Savage package deal in .308 with the scope that will be ok for a couple years and then upgrade it to what you can afford.  Cheap, amazing accuracy, huge range of bullets that will be appropriate for coyotes to elk.  One thing your friends might not realize is that bullets (not cartridges, but the actual bullet itself) is nearly as important as the cartridge it is stuck in.  Different choices of bullet will let you use one rifle for many different tasks.
 
Good luck, and whatever you get, shoot it more than a couple times a year.  And give us pictures of it when you bring it home.

Welcome to THL. Since you are new to centerfire rifles I'm going to assume that you don't reload. If I was restricted to factory ammo I would shy away from most of the newer calibers or the 8X57. I would also stay away from the 35 Whelen or 358 Winchester for the same reason. Factory ammo is hard to come by and limited in selection. Don't let Gitano see me say this but the 308 would be a great choice. Ammo is everywhere and ranges from a 150gr SP for deer to a 180gr Partition Federal HE load for elk. The 30-06 would be a great choice too.
 
As for which rifle the Savage is a great choice. They're accurate and inexpensive. I would invest in a quality scope. If you are not set on a brand new rifle your friend can help you find a real good one at a pawn shop. Just yesterday I passed on a Winchester Model 70 300 WSM with a Simmons scope for $377. I just can't justify it as I already have 2 30-06s and a 338 Win Mag.
 
You can use a deer rifle for coyotes as long as you don't plan to save the pelt. If you want to save the pelt then I would HIGHLY recomend getting an identical rifle in 223 or 22-250.

Well, here goes......and remember, I basing this on what you already use.
The 243 Win is a very useful rifle and from what I've seen can be successfully used on lots of game.
You're already using one and obviously are accustomed to it so it is a good option, not the least because there is a lot of premium factory ammo made for it.
If you wish to spend less on ammo a .22-250 or 223 Rem would be cheaper and if you are really interested in a small cal that is nastily accurate on varmints and predators I heartily recommend the 204 Ruger.
As far as a larger rifle goes you say you borrowed a 300 Ultra Mag.
Were you comfortable with it?
If so I wuldn't have too many qualms about buying a magnum, whether it be a 300 WSM, a 300 Win Mag or even a 338 Win Mag.
Even a 7mm Rem Mag would serve your purposes and provide you with plenty of options for really long shots should the opportunity provide itself.
Alternatively, if the idea of a magnum seems excessive consider buying a 30-06.
It'll take down almost anything in Nth America with the exception of the big bears and there is an endless amount of factory ammo ranging between stuff only good enough for making tin cans into collanders all the way to light magnum premium loads suitable for serious game hunting.
Any number of the more experienced hunters on this forum have used the '06 to good effect many times.
For all those forum members who know my preferences and can't believe it's me writing this remember this guy doesn't load his own and is after a straight forward rifle.
Now, as for bargain but quality rifles, there are a few I can recommend.
Firstly, the Weatherby Vanguard range are good reliable rifles that come with a 1.5" 3-shot premium ammo group guarantee out of the box.
There are a huge range of them and they also feature a Sub-MOA range (that's under an inch at 100yds) which have received excellent reviews.
Next, if you really don't want to spend much and are interested in function over form there is hardly a better rifle than the Stevens 200s.
The stock is as homely as mule's behind but it's pillar bedded and many Canadian shooters have bought themselves several 200s in different cals because of the low cost and the amazing accuracy.
If you really hate the battleship grey colour of the stock simply get some spray paint (apparently Grycol is good) and pretty it up in whatever pattern you like......camo, granite look, etc.
And finally Tikka T3s, while being perhaps a little more than other lower level rifles, are VERY good.
Most shoot sub-MOA out of the box and they come in varying models too.
They're made by SAKO and although they aren't as good as a SAKO they're brilliant rifles and many guys here in Oz swear by them.
I intend to pick up one myself at the end of this year.
So there you are.
More important than anything else though, is simply to get into a gunstore and shoulder the rifles.
If they fit right and feel comfortable then that's the most important thing.
BTW, for an inexpensive but good quality scope the Bushnell Elite 3200 and 4200 scopes are hard to go past.
A 3-9x40 will probably do for your deer rifle and 4-16x40 or the like would be best for your small bore varmint/predator rifle.
And for the record the Weatherby and Tikka should come with rings.

beschliem, welcome to THL. Already I suppose you are as confused as I am by the suggestions. You don't say where you live. Sounds like you might live in Indiana or Ohio across the river from me. They both have that stupid law "shotguns only" for deer but high power rifles are fine for varmints, unless things have changed recently. If I lived under those circumstances, I would buy a NEF Handi Rifle for varmints in 204 Ruger or 22/250 Rem. You aren't going to get many quick second shots at varmints and this "economical" single shot is plenty accurate for that. For the larger game you mention, it would be difficult to beat a bolt gun in 308 or even another NEF Handi Rifle.  I have NEVER had "need" for repeaters. Ammo for the three choices I suggested are readily available most anywhere and bullet selection is large. ..........Paul H

Paul is entirely right.
For your varmint gun a heavy bbl NEF/H&R Handi-Rifle in 204 Ruger or 22-250 is ideal.
My friend has a 204 Handi-Rifle and it is amazingly accurate.
But I'd stick with a repeater for your larger centrefire.

For "deer ,elk, and caribou" a .308 win or a 30-06 is hard to beat. .223 is a great one for smaller fur bearing stuff. Why these three? They have all been around a while and have been/are used by military units worldwide. You can walk into almost anyplace they sell ammo and find many types of all three. They are relatively inexpensive cartridges. They get the job done without a lot of extra "fluff'"(recoil, advertisements, and cash).
As for a rifle I also am a big savage fan. Their combos are a great value. The H&R Handi-Rifle is nothing to sneeze at either. If you don't mind a single shot, you couldn't go wrong with one with 2 barrels. That would be about the cheapest way to get two rifles. Now neither is poorly made. Both are accurate, durable, dependable rifles that are also (thank God) very affordable.
Your scope is your connection between you and your quarry. Buy as good of a scope as you can afford. I prefer Burris now that I have one on my .308. It cost as much as the rifle but it was worth every penny. Leupold is also a great company. They both have forever warranties. Less expensive, but very usable, scopes are more common than they used to be and for deer they are fine. If you plan to travel for other game save up for the higher priced ones. They are generally more durable and have better optical quality. Usually the more a scope costs the better the clarity of the optics will be. Sitting in a deer stand its not a real big deal, but on a mountain it might be.
Are you a cheesehead, eh?

Nothing to add here, you have gotten some good suggestions. Filter though them and then just go buy it and start having fun. Like Paul said, you pretty much can't go wrong, they all make a good rifle, it is going to come down to wich one you like best. God Bless.

an NEF handi in .30-'06 ... or a used remington or winchester or savage or ruger bolt gun in a deer-appropriate chambering. and as good a glass as you can afford.

A shooting mate bought a Mossberg ATR in .243. I was impressed with the rifle compared to the money he paid for it. It easliy shoots MOA at one hundred metres. But I would go for a Howa or Weatherby Vangard, they are the same action. I have shot the Stevens 200 and it shoots very well but the stock is the worst moulding I have ever seen!!

Thank you for all the advice you have given to this point.  I will have to wait a couple weeks before I get the chance to check things out due to commitments this weekend.  May ask more questions in Madison at the Wisconsin Deer and Turkey Expo  April 4th through the 6th.  Please continue to help "Guide" me on my quest for my first and possibly second rifle(s).

Well if you've read through all this advice you really are serious.